If you are offended when people wish you a merry Christmas – I can guaruntee that this post will offend you. You have been warned, enjoy!
I went to Wal Mart tonight only to be turned away because it was closing, I felt like they were a bunch of Anti-Semites for not keeping it open for those of us who do not celebrate Christmas. Wait isn’t Wal Mart the one’s who made a “Happy birthday Hitler cake”?
I was thinking about new chumras that can be made in honor of Christmas or shall I say Chrotzmas or Xmas. If someone really wants to show that they are not acknowledging the existence of Christmas – how can they take advantage of holiday parking rules in New York City, I propose that all Jews should move their cars like it were a normal day.
I didn’t know this until last year, but many shuls will daven shachris at a regular time due to the nature of not acknowledging Christmas as a holiday. Dallas doesn’t adhere to those rules, and in Dallas they are so progressive that all of the shuls have special shiurim and breakfasts in honor of the holiday.
Do any of you celebrate Christmas? Do you eat Chinese food? – I think this is just a secular Jewish thing. Do you think attending a matzo ball is the right way to go about it – seems like it’s just another excuse for Jews to party. Thousands of years of persecution at the hands of the Christians, screw it, lets party.
Do you really get offended when people say “merry Christmas” to you? Sounds a little childish to me, its not like they are saying – accept our lord as your savior or burn in hell! Besides it makes me feel that even though I am wearing my tzitzis and yarmulke these people can’t tell a Jew from a Buddha. I always respond with merry Christmas or merry chaunkah – either or works for me.
What do atheists do on Christmas? Is it like the Jewish way of celebrating by having atheist matzo balls? Maybe they have atheist chagigas? Do they celebrate with the intention of only celebrating the secular irreligious aspect of Christmas – which is basically everything – who the hell goes to church on Christmas anyway?
Christmas songs vs. Chanukah songs = Christmas wins by far, I don’t see Frank Sinatra doing Chanukah songs, what about some Chanukah oldies – like that song “it was a miracle a nase to remember a miracle come true”? The only bad thing about Christmas songs besides for the fact that stores start playing them in October and they don’t stop for 5 months is that when you do want to hear classics like Jingle Bells Rock and Rocking Around the Christmas Tree you have to wait a full year, similar to the Monster Mash song.
Did the Christians really copy Chanukah or did these two “similar” holidays just randomly happen at this time?
I wonder how white bearded frummies react to the multitudes of kids stopping them and asking of they are Santa Clause – can someone tell me what on earth Jesus has to do with Santa Clause – they are almost contrarian – the fat and jolly gift giver vs. the emaciated hippy who took some bad acid. They aren’t even from the same region – Santa is definitely from the north and Jesus was a Mediterranean fellow.
Did any of you Jewish folks who grew up in secular environs actually celebrate Christmas, besides for celebrating the tradition of deforestation and rampant consumerism what is the difference between Thanksgiving and Christmas?
And for you folks that used to celebrate Christmas but do not anymore, how on earth do you un-celebrate such an event. I am sure you saved loads of money, and you probably saved one more tree from its eventually resting place as a woodchip pile near a city bike path. Do you still buy people Christmas presents.
I know I am going to get bashed for this but Christmas reminds me of Yom Kippur, its basically the climax of a month long event and then its over – that’s how I feel after Yom Kippur – I always think – wow that’s it??? The Muslims have something right – they do 40 freaking days – then its over.
Besides for over playing of Christmas songs by adult contemporary radio stations the most annoying aspect of Christmas are those darned Salvation Army bell ringers, do you know how badly I want to pay them to shut up – they are kind of like that mime on ben yehuda whom you have to pay to do an act – well maybe not because it seems like they never shut up.
Where on earth did the tree come from? Is this a hotly debated minhag amongst Christian scholars, is there such a thing as Christian scholars who debate trivial things such as this or whether or not you can drink eggnog before or after putting the gifts under the tree. Are there any other Christmas minhagim? Like do the charedi Christians get spruce instead of fir trees? Or do some people get bushes (not including the Chanukah bush crowd) instead of trees citing the halacha of not being to gaivadik.
What does the Christmas seuda consist of is it similar to Thanksgiving? I noticed that Empire turkeys were on sale tonight, I was wondering of the sale coincided with erev Christmas on purpose. Do people actually drink eggnog, because it looks gross and for some reason I always think its just a cold creamy version of egg drop soup – ironic because the Chinese are notoriously anti-Christmas, or maybe they just put that out there so the Jews will eat in their restaurants during Christmas. Wait does this mean that dry cleaners are open on Christmas? (My non-politically correct father called the cleaners – “the Chinamen”)
You could be judged on how you refer to Christmas, do you say Chrotzmas or Xmas or just go on ignoring all of the Chassidishe guys dressed in bright red (untznius for a woman, just right for a man on purim) I have noticed that the frummies love using any form of Krotzmas, Krochsmas or as Yinglish as possible to reference it.
What on earth do man hating feminists do on Christmas? I am talking about those women that spell womyn without the use of “men” in the word. Do they have their own lady Santa Clauses similar to the way some women become rabbis, wait maybe the women Santa Clauses are all those girls that drank the havdalah wine as kids and could therefore grow a beard.
yes yes i agree…. Santa – the jolly fat man … and the acid overdosing looking Jesus !!!!!! (still laughing here 🙂
Christmas hardly means anything to most people in America these days.
If someone wished me a happy Hannukah I wouldn’t get offended…
Christmas, like most Christian holidays, has its roots in much older, pagan traditions. The use of a tree with gifts under it goes all the way back to ancient Egyptian mythology and the resurection of Osirus, if I remeber correctly. Saint Nicholas’ saint’s day is in early December, and because he was the patron saint of children, among other things, his day was celebrated by giving small gifts to kids. Over time his saint’s day and Christmas were conflated. Throw in “The Night Before Christmas” in the mid 1800s and Thomas Nast’s paintings of a jolly fat man, and the modern legend was born.
Its very unlikely Christmas is a copy of Chanukah. If anything, giving gifts on Chanukah is probably copied from Christmas, helped along by the minhag of Chanukah gelt. Its far more likely that Chanukah, Christmas, and a whole bunch of other holidays that used to be celebrated this time of year are solstice holidays. The lights are a form of sympathetic magic – the sun is out fir the shortest time druing the solstice, and our lights (which are symbolicly like the light of the sun) help to strengthen it and bring it back. Its very possible that Chanukah borrowed the idea of lights from existing Greek, Roman, and Egyptian traditions, and spun it to relate to the rededication of the Bais HaMikdash. Christmas is almost certainly a Christian replacment for the exisiting psgsn solstice holidays. Replacing pagan holidays with Christain equivlants was common during the early history of the Church as they tried to attract converts. People don’t like giving up their holidays.
And one more thing. The “X” in Xmas stands for Xristos, the greek word for Christ. So saying Xmas isn’t a way to avoid saying Christmas.
OK, I’ll stop now.
1. Atheists have Festivus, it’s for the rest of us…
2. You gotta love nitl nacht….no learning, and no guilty feelings.
3. The 24 hour run of A Christmas Story on TBS is my favorite way to spend nitl nacht
G3 you rock – are you a fan of G3 as well?
Ed thanks for the info
“Its very possible that Chanukah borrowed the idea of lights from existing Greek, Roman, and Egyptian traditions, and spun it to relate to the rededication of the Bais HaMikdash.”
Chanukah didn’t borrow anything. The idea of lights was created for the sake of Chanukah and was only rightfully claimed when the beis hamikodsh was rededicated. The world was created lshaim Torah, not the other way around.
As I was leaving a store the other day, the lady said to me happy xmas. I replied happy chaunka. She got P.O.’ed at me. Also since my parents dont keep kosher, and I do. They just want a nice meal tomorrow so were having empire turkey dinner. I just dont want to do it tomorrow night. but hey what ever.
i live in dallas and just to clarify. one particular shul there flys in a speaker for there “legal holiday lecture” on christams as they do on labor day,thanksgiving, etc. ans they also have a breakfast before the speaker. its not in honer of christmas or anything like that. i cant really understand why someone would go al crazy bc someone said merry christmas
great post
Why would you wish someone a happy chanukah if they just wished you a merry christmas?
Actually the tree came from pagans called the Asheira. Hence the name commonly found in the talmud “Asheira” meaning trees that were worshipped.
Santa was brought in Through a guy named Nicolos from turkey. He was later declared a saint by the church. They brought his bones from turkey to rome, and made saint nicholos day december 6th. There was another pagan culture around who worshipped a G-d, who supposedly ran on the clouds at the end of december. To influence them to become Christian, they placed it on the 25th like all other holidays mixed in to christmas. They also decided saint nick would be the one who goes around at that night.
Then through many years, it changed from, a guy from turkey to a guy in the north pole, who had elves and would beat children if they werent nice. Then Nast’s comics made him into a jolly fellow, and the coke cola company gave him the red coat.
It’s no coincidence that holidays celebrating light occur around the time of the winter solstice, the darkest day (times) of the year.
hilarious article
the xmas tree is an adopted european pagan tradition. xmas occurs during the winter solstice, the day with the least sunlight. decorating trees was a way to appeal to the nature spirits/gods to ensure the sun’s return to longer hours.
and santa claus originated from saint nick who i believe was from norway or somewhere like that. the modern santa claus is mostly a creation of the last century or so by retailers and stores trying to sell americans crap. the founding fathers had no clue who santa claus was.
anyways xmas, jesus’s birthday (if he really lived at all) is the same as osiris, and many of the other ancient gods whom the story of jesus was copied from
Why dont we celebrate the fact that the vast majority of us dont have to work tomorrow and just get merrily wasted?
When somebody congratulates me with the goyishe thing, I answer, “Happy Chanukah”.
Most people don’t, though. Here’s an advice: if you don’t want people to mistake you for a goy and wish you the you-know-what, look like a Jew. Usually it involves wearing kipah, tzitzis and beard (for a guy).
Do the people who don’t say Christmas say Tenksgiving and Fierth of July, too? (jk) Funny.
you made me laugh so so hard I can hardly stand it. I am going to post the comment about christmas music as the best Christmas quote!
BTW, Christmas is not really a strictly Christian Holiday. You were so right. It comes from a Roman Holiday called Saturnalia… where they hauled trees in and decorated them…,giving gifts to one another etc. When Constantine became a Christian he announced that the empire was now Christian. They like their holiday so they re-named it Christmas. Scholars say Jesus was born around October as the Shepherds were outside watching their flocks at night. Of course the devotion is innocent enough and the worship is pure, just the trappings…what’s ironic to me is the blessing Christmas is to our economy. We are completely reliant on it. And Santa…? I know him.
Crawling Axe – Looking like a Jew does nothing to stop the Christmas wishes. People are extremely ignorant. More than I ever thought possible. I can’t tell you how many times in the last few weeks I have almost fallen over when store clerks have asked my kippah-wearing, peyos-sporting little boys what they want Santa to bring this year!
Do the people who don’t say Christmas say Tenksgiving and Fierth of July, too? (jk) Funny.
Well, neither Thanksgiving nor 4th of July is offensive to a Jew (nor is Ramadan, Kwanza, or whatever else), unlike the X-ian abomination.
Me (an atheist) and my atheist fiance both celebrate christmas. We go to his parents house (as does his sister), exchange gifts, decorate a tree with non-jesus-y ornaments, don’t go to mass or anything, and have two big meals (one on christmas eve, AKA erev christmas, and the other on chirstmas day which is in an hour or two). There is absolutely nothing religious for us about this holiday.
Pretty much every culture has had some sort of winter solstice holiday, since this is the darkest time of the year, and people need something to look forward to in order to cheer them up. I see no problem with that; i too need to be cheered up in the middle of the winter. 🙂
Chanukah on the other hand celebrates the victory of orthodox jews over secular (hellenistic) Jews. That I have somewhat of a problem in celebrating. (although I still had latkes this week).
Hesh,
I see Dallas is already rubbing off on you. Nowhere in my life did I see such a big deal made out of Xmas.
Due to all the evil done to Jews over the centuries in the name of the religion and it’s founder, I now refer to it as crapmas (yes I know it’s politically incorrect).
Next issue is santa. The origins of this character are definitely not from biblical times in the mideast, or he would be riding a camel and wearing a turban instead of boots and reindeer. My theory is that he was created by the child molesting priests in Europe. Why else would he put on a disguise, break into the house after everyones asleep, get the kids on his lap, ask them if they’ve been naughty then give them candy. Anyone tried this in my house, they would be schechted on the spot.
Nitul is strictly observed by chassidim, “snags” are against it. Last year I was at an Ashkenaz shul where the rabbi gives a short dvar Torah between Mincha and Maariv. Another Lubab happened to be their besides me (partial Lubab), he actually walked out. Last night after Menorah and dreidel, I sat down with the shulchan Aruch for a while, completely forgot about nittul, remebered only a few hours later.
Futurama has some pretty funny Xmas episodes, watched some over the past few days. Santa’s the all evil guy, he has these drunk / gay workers on Neptune. Special appearance by kwanza bot inviting santa to Chanukah zombie’s party.
Happy Chanukah.
Crawling Axe,
The general public is generally retarted or just ignorant. I do have a beard, wear my tzitzis out, and a yarmulke (albeit the last one is usually covered by a beret/casquete(sp??))
I get wished happy cretzmach all the time. And this is in a pretty predominantly jewish area.
Ignorance is a strong term, people just don’t know may be a little better, shit, I always stare when I see Menonites or Amish or Mormons trying to decide if they are some weird sect of Chassidim.
Abandoning Eden – that is possibly the first time I ever heard someone say the concept of Chanukah offends them – congratulations – way more liberal then anyone I have met
Chanukah celebrates the frummies win over the secular – if so why is it celebrated by secular Jews everywhere?
Abandoning Eden, if the Jewish people adopted your attitude, there wouldn’t be any Jewish people today. We would all be one mixed nation, with a little of Chinese, German, Italian, Greek, African, English, Polish, Russian and Korean in all of us today.
Abandoning Eden, maybe we should all adopt your attitude and kill ourselves. Why do good people die young? Why do evil prosper?
Why should I suffer so much, while other friends have it so easy?
If I don’t believe in G-d, then there is no purpose for me to live. If I don’t believe in G-d, and I know that after all my suffering, my life of bitter poverty, the principal who lied to get me fired (but who still has her job), my bitter divorce with my ex, etc. If I truly believe that after all my endless suffering, that I will die and that will be the end, then I might as well kill myself and end it right now, because I am sick and tired of people looking at me like a weirdo, of being excluded from social circles, of not being able to afford to dress as well as others.
You are so lucky that you have people who love you and a steady job. If I had believed that all my suffering is for no reason whatsoever except for sheer luck, trust me that I would have killed myself long ago.
Mikeinmidwood hit it perfectly but neglected to mention that Christmas has nothing to do with Christ any serious christian scholar will tell you that jesus was NOT born on Dec 25
Chanukah on the other hand celebrates the victory of orthodox jews over secular (hellenistic) Jews. That I have somewhat of a problem in celebrating. (although I still had latkes this week).
See, this opinion actually makes sense. Yep, that’s right. We celebrate the victory of us over you — religious Jews over secular atheists (and I am a former Richard-Dawkins–reading, religion-ridiculing atheist). It’s a victory of light over darkness.
You should be offended — despite the fact that there is irony in your taking offense; indeed, in your whole existence: the only reason you exist, the only reason you call yourself Jewish is due to a victory of fundamentalist Jews who saw specifically G-d (not philosophy or ethics) in Judaism and did not feel comfortable celebrating X-mas Olympic games (or whatever was Greek equivalent).
(Hmm… no “”? What’s up with that?)
Nitul is strictly observed by chassidim, “snags” are against it. Last year I was at an Ashkenaz shul where the rabbi gives a short dvar Torah between Mincha and Maariv. Another Lubab happened to be their besides me (partial Lubab), he actually walked out. Last night after Menorah and dreidel, I sat down with the shulchan Aruch for a while, completely forgot about nittul, remebered only a few hours later.
I wonder if these people learn Gemara in a bathroom. 🙂
The Salvation army and I get along just fine:
http://wwwjackbenimble.blogspot.com/2006/12/salvation-army-bell-ringer-doesnt-like.html
if u dont want to offend anyone you could just say happy “hanaramakwanzmas” [Hanukkah,Ramadan, Kwanzaa, Christmas. that way u cant go wrong in less its an athiest that youre talking to. do athiests even have any holidays?
I’m so glad to be in Israel and not hear Christmas music.
A hilarios exejesus — er, exegesis — on hilchos ha’chag, including kavunah when cutting the tree down, the variety of tree used, hachana (preparations), the timing, the placement of the tree (parsumei niece-ah), can be found here:
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Ridge/6661/other/xmas.html
You gotta check it out. Funny as anything. Of course, there is a haskama from the Kringler Rav.
I was going to go on about the pagan roots of Christmas but G3’s obviously already done it.
I confess that I love the music that plays in the malls during this season. I know I shouldn’t, but it’s good music!
As for feminists… Why the heck would a woman want to look like Santa Clause? I’m not THAT feminist.
LOLOLOLOLOL im not breathing!!!!!!!!!
Hesh – Thanks!
I’ve never heard of G3, so its safe to say I’m not a fan. The name is a pen name based on my initials through numerology that I started using back when I was young and didn’t think such things were silly.
Heterim are for Hippies, I’m not entirely sure what you mean, but you seem to imply that anything Jewish must by definition be unuiqe and authentic. To claim that Judaism over the last three and half millenia hasn’t been influenced by the cultures Jews have lived in is naive. It is possible that the menorah was instated as a Chanukah tradition independant of the existing solstice holidays. It is even more likely that the Jews of the time celebrated some form of solstice holiday involving lights that was incorporated into Chanukah.
Mikeinmidwood, the Asherah is one of many possible sources, along with Egyptians, the Druids of Germany, and others. There is a legend that the first Christmas tree was created when a saint (I forget his name) cut down a holy Druidic tree in central Germany and used it for Christmas. But the use of a tree during the solstice holidays goes back a long way, whatever the actual source. Nicholas was a bishop in Turkey. He probably actaully did wear a red coat (all bishops did / do) but it probably didn’t look like the one we picture when we think of Santa.
abandoning eden, that is impressive, and I’m jealous that I didn’t think of it. Still, remember that Chanukah was as much about the Chashmonaim seizing power from the Selucids as it was about religion. And that the Hellenized Jews were not “secular” the way you mean it. They either tacked the Greek pantheon onto Judaism or embraced it completely.
You’re on the mark about moving the car so we don’t derive pleasure from Xmas. We should also not shop at the after-Xmas sales.
In fact, we shouldn’t even allow Jews to sell stuff to the goyims BEFORE the holiday, in case they plan to use it as an Xmas gift.
Wait, have I just destroyed the entire Jewish economy? Oops.
Bottom line is we have one of 2 possible theories on the origins of the creation of xmas:
1) It was created by drunk goyim as an excuse for another day to skip work and go drinking.
2) It was created enterprising Jews that figured out that drunk goyim like to spend lots of $$$ on holiday shopping.
Wait, does this mean I can’t sing Xmas carols anymore, even if I elide Jesus’ name?
Oh, dang!
How about, “Tis the season to be freilich”?
Or, “What a friend we have in Yeshu”?
“Deck the heim”?
“Refael the kosher raindeer”?
“I’m dreaming of a geshmake Chanuka”?
Tis the season to be freilich!!!!
I’m dreaming of a geshmake Chanukah… Wow, that’s good.
i asked my super christian co-worker why churches have x-mas trees when they have nothing to do with religion. in her classic, lets say, brainwashed, way…she said “it’s not an x-mas tree…it’s an EPIPHANY tree.” so i asked her what that was and she said she didn’t know but it was white and not green.
yikes.
1 yall wanna see a really weird christmas thing? Go look up Krampus
2 We didnt celebrate Dec 25th this year, but I still gave my wife a gift. Note to married men: giving your wife a gift at any time doesnt hurt and can help.
3 I gave presents to my family members. Conversion in progress or not, no need to be a jerk to family.
4 Atheists celebrate? Who knew? I thought they were too angry to celebrate anything 🙂
holy krampus!!!!
now i’m glad i never stayed up all night waiting for santy claus!
You guys are hilarious!!!! I think I will say “Merry Chanukah” to my family (non-Jews) who get mad that I don”t say Merry X-Mas…lol.
Yes, people are incredibly ignorant. This whole thread proves it:
1. It’s hard for Jews to get the idea of the Christian religion (and vice versa). Judaism is a religion of 1,000 rules (well, let’s say 613). In Christianity, every thing is permitted unless it is explicitly forbidden. In the area of religious celebration, unless you are explicitly worshipping another god, you can do whatever you want. If you want to get a statue of Buddha and dress it up as Santy and use it as a decoration, feel free to do so. As long as you know it’s not real and it’s just for fun and for a decoration. Churches can put up Christmas trees and any other decoration they feel like. Sometimes, to paraphrase Freud, a tree is just a tree — just a pretty decoration to make the church look nice. Catholic churches have certain things they HAVE to have (a crucifix, a place to reserve the sacrament, etc.). Beyond that — knock yourself out (or don’t). Some protestant churches are totally plain and have decorations at all.
2. Of course Jesus wasn’t born on December 25th. Everybody knows that. And nobody cares. Christianity is not obsessed with times and dates. Americans arbitrarily picked the third Thursday in November to have Thanksgiving. The Church didn’t celebrate Christmas at all for a long time. Then they decided they should have a special mass (“Christ’s mass) to celebrate the birth of Christ. Not knowing when it was, they picked a day close to the solstice for the symbolism that “the light of Christ has come into the world.” (“A people that walked in darkness have seen a great light.”) They could announce tomorrow that they were changing it to July 4th and it would still be Christmas.
3. To the person who has a “super Christian” colleague who doesn’t know what Epiphany is. May I suggest that that is somewhat like saying that you get all your information about Judaism from a “super orthodox Jewish colleague” who has no idea what Simchat Torah is. Perhaps your idea of a “super Christian” is somebody who goes to church twice a year. Or maybe once but wears a cross around her neck.
4. The Santy thing is pretty much an American invention. Christmas is slowly (rapidly?) becoming totally secularized. Non-Christians who like all the externals of Christmas love Santy and trees and Jingle Bell in the malls and all that. And that’s fine. But it has nothing to do with Christmas.
shut up idiots